SPEAKER_03: 0:00

Welcome back to our podcast and this is Nadia. Together with Olifia and Rich, we're kicking off this episode with a massive singing guila to everyone. And so we are will officially enter the year of the fire horse, a year that in Chinese astrology represents high energy, rapid movement, and bold innovation. And if you're a student who has been listening to our podcast before, you knew that we are mainly discussing about overseas studies, about applications and opportunities for international students. And so what we notice is changing or upgrading recently is how the application game is actually changed. So we're looking into how AI impacted our lives now. So students are also actively using AI and it's becoming a thought partner for students, helping students in many different areas from studying to preparation to also university applications. But it also comes with cautions too, and also how students can also use AI responsibly. But it's not just how we learn that's changing, it's also where. So we're also witnessing pivot in students' mobility in where they are choosing to studies. Because for decades, students they all want to study in the big four destinations. So UK, US, and then Canada and Australia. Everybody wants to go there. But with rising costs and also tighter visa caps in some destinations, students are pivoting into other rising destinations, which is something that we will also be discussing today. So to in today's episode, we have a packed agenda. We have a huge menu for all of you to help you stay ahead of these topics. So there are we'll be discussing about AI for admissions. So we will bring break down the specific AI tools that students can use for your university applications and how you can use it responsibly. And also we will be talking as well about the rising destinations and why students are moving away from the big four destinations and where, like which destinations are they going to. And then also about global careers, because we understand that it's so important for international students to also think about their careers. And a lot of them they have desire to start their own business overseas or maybe do an internship overseas or even being able to land a career overseas after they've finished their studies. And also we will be talking about how AI is developing there too. And last but not least, yeah, we will be discussing about CSEA, the CSEA exam for Chinese universities, and then we'll dive into it and for the preparations on how you can prepare for the next CSEA. Okay, so I think yeah, we should not wait anymore. We can just jump right into the first topic uh for today's podcast, where we'll be discussing about AI for uh admissions. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 2:50

Yeah, Nadia, we has been researching the latest AI tools students are using, and yeah, I'll be asking some critical questions about how effective and safe they are because yeah, some students using AI maybe for drafting the personal statement and everything. Okay, Nadia, based on your experience, what is the most popular AI tools that students currently use for the university applications? And how can students use AI responsibly when drafting the personal statement without making it sound robotic or overly generic?

SPEAKER_03: 3:27

Yeah, yeah, I understand that very much. I think when using AI, sometimes it sounds a bit robotic and it's like less of a human voice, right? So when you read it, you know, like, oh, it's generated by AI, it's not like you know, original, original. So I think one of the things is well, AI has definitely a lot of functions. We could use it for so many different things. And then for students, when it's related to university applications, they could use AI for brainstorming ideas. Let's say you're stuck on what is like what is the thing that you can include in your personal statements. I think you can also get some more ideas, like basically have like ideas from AI, and also it can help you like on how to structure your essays or structure your personal statement better, improving languages, especially related to grammaritical error, or is there any typos there? And then they could also help you with mock interviews, like maybe you can also, you know, ask AI to prepare you some questions so you can do like a mock interview practice by yourself or with AI's help. Right, and then other than that, they could also help you with email writing because it's like so good to have like a good impact in the university. So if you can write the email professionally, that will create like a lasting impact to the university side as well. And then I think the way on how we can keep it so it's not like you know, it's less robotic and more of like a human voice, is just do not copy and paste full AI generated uh results. So I think it should still come from us. So use AI like it's your assistant, but not your brain, if you get what I mean. So the whole ideas about what you are going to write in your personal statement, all the key points that you want to include in the personal statements, everything, it must come from you. It must come from your original ideas, not something that is generated by AI. Because I think ultimately we know ourselves better than uh these machines. So we should be able to, you know, to let this idea out and then turn it into a personal statement. And we can just ask AI's help to maybe help to structure it better or like check for some grammar errors, typo, and etc. And then yeah, it's it's basically important to stay as original as possible. So don't just ask AI to create everything for for you from scratch. Because yeah, you have to also appreciate your yourself and also your ideas. And then if let's say AI generated the results from you, like after they edit out or like they give you some suggestions, I think it's also good that we read that again. Don't like you know just copy and paste or like trust trust it 100% because sometimes we have our own voice too, we have our own tone in like writings or maybe making videos or whatever. So make sure that we still include that touch in the final results, yeah. And in terms of the apps itself, like the AI tools that we can use, I think there are numerous that are quite popular. For example, when making personal statements, we can easily use like Grammarly for checking the grammar error and also check the languages, and then we could also use like Chat GPT, an alternative to it, as like to brainstorm ideas and also to structure your personal statement, and then also maybe to create like interview practice with you. So I think we could use that and then university applications, it could be overwhelming at times. I mean, as a student, especially, because you also have a lot of other tasks besides applying to Uni's. So there are some tools like Notion AI, for instance, that you can use to help trap the timeline for your applications, so you could make like a schedule on like when you should be preparing for things, and then it's basically to keep you organized and also plan the documents checklist, and then also Canva AI, maybe to edit videos or like making CVs or making portfolios. And you could also use our AI, Channel Admissions Marco Polo AI, to help you compare programs and also check for documents, like what's the requirements of this and that, and it's embedded in our website too. So, yeah, that's I think that's pretty much how we can optimize uh the use of AI, but also remember to stay uh responsible when using AI too.

SPEAKER_02: 7:52

That's really amazing, right? That we can brainstorm, we can yeah, strategically to make a categorized what should we do and everything. But I'm also curious can AI actually have students just the right universities and programs? Maybe they can give you some suggestions, but yeah, in the real life to understand about the experience, maybe they literally need humans. And yeah, if yes, how should they prom it properly? Can AI help students identify scholarship opportunities and tailor their motivation letter more strategically? Yeah, what do you think about that?

SPEAKER_03: 8:32

I think I agree with uh your statement, Alefia. I mean, it's amazing on how we can use AI in so many different things, but also there are some things that I think we still need like other people's real life experience, or like we still need like real experts, right? When choosing programs, for instance, I think AI can give you some suggestions based on like the general requirements and all that, but to be to make it like a very specific case based on your own qualifications or like to compare it with other students' results, I think that's something that maybe AI is not going to give you a perfect result on that because there's also limitations on how much they know. And then I think experts, I mean, like like for instance at Chan Admissions, that's something that we can excel more than AI because we've been there and we've we have assisted the students in their applications, and basically we have known the the case itself for each student, and from there we have also like a growing experience and a growing expertise on what it's looked like in real life. Because sometimes what it's stated in the website or like in the brochure, it's not necessarily what it is in the real practice. So sometimes students are wondering like I've met the minimum requirements, but why I'm still not accepted. There are cases like that too, right? So that's why I think in cases like this, you still need the experts' help and opinion to help you move forward. It's still very much valuable to get opinions, let's say, from Channel Admissions to help you get going with the university applications, in especially in selecting which are the best programs that will be suitable for your specific profile.

SPEAKER_02: 10:12

Yeah. And yeah, you are also working together and collaborates with many universities. So I want to know, like, from admissions perspective, what are the biggest mistakes that the students make when they rely too much or like too heavily on AI? And where do you think the ethical boundaries in between AI as a tool and AI doing the work for you? Because yeah, we are still so it's a lot of students, like literally, we can recognize when they write the personal statement, like, oh okay, this is AI. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 10:51

Yeah. I think that's one of the biggest, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's it's that long dash. Yeah. I think that's one of the biggest uh mistakes. Like something I mentioned earlier. It's like when you copy and paste everything without checking. I think because their students sometimes they did that. Maybe they have other responsibilities, like you know, homeschool, sorry, like projects or like homework, things like that, that it makes you, you know, like I just want to get this done like really fast. So you just copy and paste whatever. So I think that's the number one mistake. You should always check everything before copy and paste, and then make sure that it's not like AI generated, because then again, the original ideas and everything has to be you, and you should think that AI is like your assistant, you know, it's like your editor. It's like you're writing a book, for instance, and then the author have an editor to help you edit some parts, maybe just to make your essays flow better and then sound it better, and then also remove any unnecessary or like any unnecessary redundancies, or maybe there are some grammar etical errors, typos are the things that I think you should be using AI for, but not asking AI to pretend to be you and then generate the results that are like generate the personal statement or essay questions for you. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02: 12:09

Yeah, as you mentioned earlier, some students can also draft about the interview preparation. Yeah. And can AI stimulate university interview effectively? Because some students, yeah, they need the mock-up interview, and with the AI, actually it's really helpful. And some students are tempted to use AI during online interview, so it's really, really dangerous, right? So, what are the risks technically and ethically? Are the university can easily recognize okay, the students is using AI, or maybe during the interview online, there is some rules and regulations during the interview session. So, yeah, they cannot cheat in, for example, like that.

SPEAKER_03: 12:55

Yeah, I think in terms of that, because it's a rising technology, I think university will need to also update some of their rules, right? To have it like to have a better precautions for the future as well. So not to let these type of students who let's say they want to utilize AI uh to to pretend to be themselves and then do the interview for them. And then other than that, I think you can use AI for other things that are better. Let's say uh you can ask AI to help you traff sample questions that you can use for practice. So instead of using AI to replace you, so you can just use AI for, you know, as a pretend like buddy to help you practice the exam or like just just generate some of the sample questions for you so you can practice by yourself, or like clad yeah, just basically that, I think, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_04: 13:50

What do you think about some of the universities are using AI in the interviews as well? What do you think about that?

SPEAKER_03: 13:56

I think that's interesting, right? That's that's pretty recent, and I heard that already. I think some in China did that or planning to do that. Uh well, and in the university side, maybe it saves their time and their costs somehow, because it's kind of like a repetitive thing if you wanted to see it that way, because they have to interview so many applicants uh within, you know, like several weeks, for instance, and they have to finish off all of them. Yeah, I think it's like plus and minus because I believe that there are things that robots cannot sense that are only us humans can sense. Yeah. Like when you're doing like an interview with people, you know how sincere they are, things like that, like those type of feelings where, in my opinion, uh there's a limitations to how much these uh AI, these robots can can sense. And it's like how the applicants are being honest in their answers, or like, you know, like things like that. It's not because in my opinion, when you're doing interview with with students or with anyone, it's not just all about the answers, though they are important, but it's also how we see them. We see their real uh intentions behind the interviews, we see their motivations and also their seriousness in doing the interviews. And I think it's so much better, like it can be captured better if it's if it's done by humans, not robots. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 15:18

Yeah, there's something about the human connection that's very you can connect with someone really well. And it's very different to talking to a robot.

SPEAKER_02: 15:28

Yeah, yeah. It's helping Emily, one of our VIP students, and then as is from India, she was applying for Shanghai University, and then she was sharing to us how her experience through the interview online sessions with an AI. And then during the interview sessions, it's actually the university already had their own platform, their own website that they can start the interview sessions and the AI will ask some questions. Oh, let's let's introduce yourself, and then there is time like a timekeeper, like there is a specific time duration that they need to introduce themselves, for example, like in three to five minutes, and then go to the next question, and then yeah, it will be takes like around 20 minutes. Yeah, I think that I just realized that some of the universities in China already using AI for the online interfaces for the early stage. So yeah, that that was amazing. That's really fast. And maybe because they have yeah, the university has a lot of like thousands of applications, and then they want to make it effective and efficient. So yeah, I assume maybe for the next two years or three years, more and more universities will do the same for the early stage of the selection process. So it will be, yeah, maybe some students need to adapt with the technology as well. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04: 16:55

Yeah, one of the points is that AI can actually be better eliminating bias because sometimes when you're interviewing someone, you like people who are similar to yourself, and so that's why AI can be helpful, but it's also important in the decision-making process that it's separated, it's like a human making the final decision. I think that's really important, and really under because a lot of these models you don't actually know what it's thinking, and you don't know the way it's thinking, so it's really important to there's it's a very fine line, I think, between that. So they can be used in so many things, right? Like in research, in augmenting, in preparing for the application, in conversational help, and our AI is really helpful for asking specific questions on our platform. And we have Marco Polo and we have Leonardo da Vinci on global admissions. So, yeah, do you guys have anything else to discuss about that topic?

SPEAKER_03: 17:53

I think I was wondering about how AI will influence careers, because like AI is basically everywhere, right? Like everywhere we go, it's like all related to AI nowadays. So I figured that, you know, like our careers in the future or maybe related to that. Like, how how do you think would be the impact of AI in careers and how it will influence and stuff?

SPEAKER_02: 18:16

Yeah. I think when we talk about AI, I don't think that it's just about AI going to replace jobs. I think that's too simplistic. What's really happening is the AI changing how we work, and most of the job won't disappear completely, but the job description will evolve and the repetitive job, like task-based parts, might be automated. But yeah, the thinking, decision making, the strategic parts will become more valuable. So I see I see it in the three passes. So maybe the students can also learn and then improve their skills. So first, I think the AI asks augmentation. It helps us for work faster, writing, research, coding, and also like brainstorming. It's literally, as you mentioned earlier, Nadia, it's really amazing that we are having an assistant. And yes, like some roles will be reduced and especially repetitive or maybe like administrative work will be replaced. But the exciting part, the new role is being created that didn't exist in a few years ago, like AI specialist, automatization designer, AI compliance role. So this has also become a trend. Like some students they really want to apply to this major because it's really literally entirely new career path. So for the student, I think the key message is don't just rely on your degree. You need digital literacy, you need to understand how to use AI tools strategically, and most importantly, you need to prove of your work. So let's say they want to apply some jobs or trying to apply internship and everything. So I think in the future, it's not human versus AI, it's people who use AI versus people who don't. So yeah, maybe it can be helpful, but yeah, it can be also make you lazy. Like if you really don't use it as a good weapons. Yeah, I think that's the thing.

SPEAKER_03: 20:30

Yeah, I think I agree with that. It could make us uh feel a bit lazy. But do you have any thoughts on? I think there are also some concerns where students thought, you know, maybe some of these degrees will get replaced by AIs in the future. Maybe what I am learning right now, and then it's a bachelor's program, will not be relevant in the next four years. Like what do you think of that? Like, do they need any specific, uh do they need to choose any specific majors to stay relevant with especially with with this AI everywhere? Or do you think it doesn't matter what they study? Because then again, it's also how you will become tech savvy, like you have that tendency to still learn about the digital world.

SPEAKER_02: 21:14

Yeah, I think in my opinion, degree is still important administratively because you will compete with a lot of people trying to explore the job market and everything. So that's yeah, you need to prove that you are learning something. But without besides that, beyond of the academic experience, you need to also like improve yourself, some skills, and update with soft skills or other like uh your self development. Because, for example, like yeah, when the student wants to export internship or maybe the job market, the employers don't just want to see the grades, they want to know like, can you actually perform in the real working environment? And you Yeah, that's that's why some students really want to go to the internship because yeah, they want to experience it. And if we talk about China specifically, that's yeah, they there are strong opportunities in tech and AI, manufacturing and supply chains, e-commerce, green energy, startups in the major cities like Shanghai and Sunzhen is growing so fast. So this kind of area, yeah, maybe like in the job market, the like the talents is deficit, but they really need the people to understand about these things. And of course, that student need to understand, for example, like the new innovation impact and everything. So I think the students definitely need to understand about the trends and not only learn about their major but also the other things, because yeah, there there's a debate between specialists and generalists, but I think you should understand about your strength and weakness. If you understand about your strength, then you will find you will find your own passion, and it's more easier for you to learn more in a specific and particular subject.

SPEAKER_04: 23:20

Yeah, so definitely it's a tough there's a lot of changes, right? I think it depends on the market, because in China you definitely need a degree to look for opportunities. In other countries, there's a rise of apprenticeships, which is people can start working instead of degree programs. And I think that's can be an increasingly interesting option for students because a lot from looking at my own experience, I've learned so much from working. Even when I was a child, I was working, like when I was a teenager, I feel like they were that was the most transformative experience for me is working and getting experience, and I think that's becoming a lot more important. And right now, especially with these changes, having some kind of evidence of projects or some kind of evidence of work is becoming a lot more important. So if people can create a website with or a company whilst they're studying, or they can create content and they have something to show online, or they have some kind of expertise, that's really, really powerful because it's every like lots more people have good degrees and good things like that. So they need to have this extra expertise. And in terms of which direction to go, it's quite challenging to know, right? Because everything is changing, so people can look at it in multiple ways. There's a saying that lots of these jobs like plumbing and roofing are always going to be in the really strong demand, but it's clear that the most important thing right now is for everyone just to get incredible at learning and learning all these tools, and that's just the main thing to focus on. Just get really good at learning and being able to use the tools and should be alright, hopefully. I think it's a it's a really cool time. I'm really super excited all the time because there's so much more you can do now, and I'm really optimistic because I think that when you when you can do much more, I think everyone will be able to create much more, but then it will just become a much more abundant world. Like the prices of things should also decrease. You should be able to get things a lot cheaper, and you can now just everything can become much more abundant, and this just could become an incredible time. But there's it's gonna be quite a lot of changes, and I think yeah, it's gonna be a really interesting time. What do you guys think about that?

SPEAKER_02: 25:38

Maybe Alifi, I can go first. Yeah, I think I think that that's true. And then besides that, as like we need to improve ourselves, and then besides AI, I think learning languages is also important, especially besides English. Even many Chinese universities offer English thought programs, but now Chinese language becomes the global business, and then some students learning Chinese as well. Yeah, I think AI it's big it can be our friends to learn like our like it can be tools like that. And yeah, I think I'm going to talk about like the global shift in education, rising study destination beyond the traditional big four and how AI reshaping career, entrepreneurship, and also the global mobility, because at the end of the day, it's not just about getting into university, it's about positioning yourself for the future. So, yeah, what do you think about that, Rich? I mean, the traditional Big Four study destination like US, UK, Canada, and Australia are threatening policies. What does this signal about the future global mobility? And from your experience, which rising destination are most strategic right now, not just for studying, but maybe building long-term career and business?

SPEAKER_04: 27:05

Yeah, so I I've we're making a report which I can share. It's actually a draft, so it's going to be updated. And I think you could look at it from the perspective of like there's yeah, there's a big shift because the big four which is where I'm from, UK, Canada, Australia. They used to be the everyone wanted to study there. And they're still the well, I have the stats here which I'll share. They're still the leading countries to study, but there's been a shift. So I can show you the the map of the big four. So there's like 700,000, I think this is last last year, 1.1 million in US. So it's still they're still like the leading countries for studying abroad, but there's a lot more that are catching up. And actually, in the last year, a lot of these countries have put reductions on the number of visas and they're starting to limit the number of people who are coming. And partly I see that is because the rising living costs and the increasing pressure on the housing and the services. And it's basically not sustainable to have a continual increase in new people coming to an economy forever if the housing and if the services are not continually being created. And so I think it's kind of a natural maturation of the market that they're kind of slowing down a bit, and that because of that is happening at the same time because of that. But there's probably also a big increase after COVID. A lot of people came to those countries, and now it's kind of like a I what I've seen quite a big trend is that they kind of comes in a lot of these things, they come in waves and then they come, they come back. So there's probably an increase in COVID and now it's pulling back, and now there's an increase into the rising destinations around the world. And so this is the places where many of the students came to the Big Fool from. And now that many people are realizing that the living costs in these countries are actually a lot cheaper. It's a lot and salaries and opportunities all are increasing quite a lot. And also these, but a lot of this comes down to birth rates and population, because a lot of these countries, as they get wealthier and there's less less housing, like especially in you're seeing it a lot in Asia, as there's a less and less housing, like in Korea, Japan, and China, less people they kind of need more people to come. And so that's like because the they need to keep the economy increasing all the time. So this is kind of something that's incentivizing it. If you look so yeah, if you look at some of these countries in Europe, Germany, France, and Italy is also increasing quite a lot. So we've actually identified, I think there's 56 rising countries right now. So there's a massive increase in options for students all over the world. And when people do these, usually in the media, they kind of miss out some of the countries like Russia and China. But actually, yeah, there's a there's a lot of students from India, from Africa who and from China who are going to Russia, there's a lot of there's like a just a massive number of options, and they all have quite affordable options, and some of them are even free. And so I think for students, if a student is smart and they're they have so many options now of great places to go, and they're all really looking to attract top people. So this is in Europe, and then if you look in Asia, there's a very big increase in Japan, South Korea. This this will be updated. Some of the countries will be in the other, so for example, UAE is in the Middle East, so we're updating this. Lots of these destinations are rising very fast, and Turkey is increasing a lot. United Arab Emirates have a very big target to increase the number of students. So there's just also South America, Latin America are seeing a big increase. A lot of it is between Latin America, but there's also an increase in students from from Europe and America who are who are looking at options there as the pricing is very affordable. There's some very good options in Latin America, and then Africa is increasing as well, especially South Africa is the number one. But Africa is really the Africa and India really the biggest, fastest growing source markets for where students are coming from now because they have a huge growing population and Southeast Asia as well, which is you guys know very you know a lot about it as well. But usually Southeast Asia is a source market, so where where people are coming from. So that's a bit of an introduction about it. Yeah. Different options.

SPEAKER_02: 31:40

What is your opinion? Like, should students start choosing countries based on the work rights and residency pathways rather than just the university rankings? Because we are seeing growth in branch campuses, like semi-degree, lower costs, fewer visa complications. And is this a smarter model for the next decade?

SPEAKER_04: 32:05

Yeah, I well, I think it's uh obviously it depends on every person, but uh there's just so many different options now. But I think it has to be more and more tailored to each person. There's not lots of people are actually choosing a destination because their friends or their family suggested it for these kind of reasons. And I I do see people because it's quite hard to know what the best options are, right? And it does make a big difference, like where you choose to study makes a big difference if you're planning to work thereafter. Some of them are much better, have much more opportunities than others. So I think choosing the destination is not so much about the destination, but it's should be a means to the ultimate goal. And where do people want to be in the future, and then they can see they can see that in the pathway. It's not like it's not the end destination, it's a it's a pathway to getting somewhere. And at the same time, what what I really think is really cool, everyone is quite different, but what I think's really cool is that you can just choose anywhere, and you can just take lots of exchange programs and you can study in multiple places. There's just so many options. You could even just take like six months in one place, you can take courses online, you can study in multiple destinations, you can like create your own program if you want, enroll in different university programs, you can take exchange programs in different places, and depending on what the student goals are, you can really get the most out of it and look for the best opportunities. I think a lot of students really care about scholarships, and that's a key thing, right? So maybe if the funding is the most important thing, then people will look at it from that angle. And then if careers or specific industry is really important, that's why I think having the personalized advice can really benefit and getting this kind of support. And I also think as part of education, having mentors is or having people who you can who can advise you is really helpful. And if you look through history, a lot of the successful leaders and the and the kings and everything, they all have had these individual like one-on-one mentors because it's just an extremely effective way at getting a good education. So people can also consider that as well. Yeah, either to help them on the journey or just to supplement their education. Because actually, if you want to work in tech or if you want to work in any industry, you can there's lots of these websites you can go on and you can just hire someone to ask for advice, or you can reach out to people and ask for advice. So that's also really quite a cool thing that people can do. So my philosophy is really that students have to take it into their own own hands much more and become a lot more entrepreneurial. And this is probably kind of how I've all how I've always thought. And I think it's the way that things are going in the future that people now people have the tools to understand and to take things into their own hands now. But I think this is the way that it's going. People can now have the tools, and that's what our whole reason for existing is to help people have the tools to make the best decision and to empower them so that they can make the best decision and find these incredible opportunities. Just there's just so many opportunities all over the world, and it's just finding the right one. And then a big part of it is choosing the people that you want to be around as well, and yeah, finding the right environment because a lot of your education happens through the people you meet. That's a really important part of it.

SPEAKER_03: 35:26

Well, talking about the pivot in the study destinations, do you think it's only triggered by the rising costs and visa complications, or do you think is there any other reasons that you know may influence the current students' decisions and changing their study destination?

SPEAKER_04: 35:45

So do you mean what's causing the change away from the big four?

SPEAKER_03: 35:52

Something like that, yeah. Like because I'm seeing like people who study in South Korea, for instance, they may go there because of culture. Like, you know, we've been yeah, we've been exposed to K-pops, the K dramas, the K's, everything. And I think that's that could influence their decision into, you know, I want to come to South Korea for studies. Do you think this also applies to like the other rising destinations?

SPEAKER_04: 36:14

Yeah, obviously uh the culture has a big draw, right? Which is why America, UK, Australia, like France, many of these places, Japan, Italy, Italy, they're just beautiful places to study, amazing experience. So they all have this draw. Yeah. There's multiple factors, right? There's like careers, there's culture. I think everyone has different reasons for studying abroad. Some of them it's maybe just something to do, or something that's like a holiday in some way. It's like, oh, I have this time now, I can kind of go and explore. But I think that's I think it's becoming more important. It's like more important to have a career to be more and more career focused. And I think students are more thinking a lot more seriously about careers now because so I think, yeah, actually the finances does become more important for a lot of students because kind of housing costs increase, but it's just a massive generalization, right? The whole market is increasing so much that there's more and more students who want to study abroad from many markets, and yeah, we're talking about in generalizations because there's just so many the study abroad market is not like one big market, it's just made of so many small markets, like Indonesians going to Korea and Vietnamese going to Japan. They're just all have their own reasons and their their own culture, and then it just they always shifting, aren't they, all the time? So, for example, Moroccans maybe they're moving away from France and then they're going looking more to China because of the cost. And then Indians are choosing Germany or lower cost countries compared to other countries. So there's there's always these shifts between destinations and trends, right? Yeah. So it's quite a fascinating web of movement.

SPEAKER_03: 37:53

Mm-hmm. Yeah, definitely. And I think China still remains one of the most popular study destinations nowadays. We see that international students are coming more and more to China. Although there's this new regulations to uh especially if they want to go for a bachelor's program at both Chinese universities where they have to complete the CSEA exam. It's the Chinese scholastic competency assessment where it's it's a relatively new thing, especially only for those who wanted to do a bachelor's program in China, but they have to take several of the exam subjects depending on what they want to study. And I think this also raised some concerns for the from the future students because they may be afraid to apply, or this, you know, this looks like an additional steps on top of their own preparations and also schools that they have to finish. Yeah, we will have the I mean the CSEA, they will have the next one in March, but I figure the registration may be open after the spring festival because spring festival is coming soon. But yeah, to answer some of these, you know, doubts or maybe some of these concerns, or to you know, to see the real experience on how is it uh taking the CSEA. I think we have also invited some students who have taken this CSEA exam before to share some more insights about the CSEA itself so you can see like we can understand it from the student's perspective on how it is and what's the preparations that other students can also do before they're taking the next CSEA exam. Other than that, because I think CSEA website, they have some guides on what you can prepare, and also in terms of the system software, things like that that you should be preparing, that you can be preparing. There are also some syllabus that you can learn from, and also at China Admissions, we have also prepared like the CSEA guide on how students can prepare for the exam and what it covers, and then what's the exam format will be. So it will be like a multiple choice, and then there's a time limit for each exam, including uh what like the subject combinations you should take. Although you can't confirm that with university the university first before you apply, because uh in some cases it could be different depending on the program that you're applying for. But I think despite that, some students are still, you know, maybe anxious in taking this exam because then again, it's something that is relatively new, so it's so much better if you know we can give some more insights and resources where students can learn.

SPEAKER_04: 40:34

So we've actually got some students there.

SPEAKER_03: 40:37

All right, thanks, Arman and Malija, for being here, especially to share your experience taking CSEA exam. And then yeah, I think I just want to know like how how is that? How difficult it is. I mean, we've heard rumors going on that maybe it's going to be as difficult as CalCao, uh the Chinese national exam, things like that. But you've took this task already. Like, did you take it in the December session or in January session? And how was your personal opinion on that? Maybe uh Arman, you can go first.

SPEAKER_00: 41:12

Okay, thanks guys. For example, so for me, I took in January and I took humanity Chinese and Mathematics, both in Chinese, and I'm applying for TCSOL, teaching Chinese for languages of other students. And for me, this experience was like 50-50, I would say, not so easy and not so hard. So I got a really great mark uh communities Chinese because I have a really high HSK. Uh, but what about math? I so I'm gonna be honest, it was really hard for me, especially for someone coming from more of like language background. It was really hard. I would say, for example, I'm coming from Armenia, and we don't use all of that information that you can see in CSA math. We don't pass it here in Armenia. So, for example, all about the ellipse, all about the problems that we have to solve at the end of the text. It was like 48 number, and all that kind of problems are so hard for us because we don't used to learn something like that. So I um recommend to everyone they that they took some, take some classes, maybe something like SAT, because I have uh talked with a lot of students, uh a lot of people, and I have showed them these tests, and they say it looks like SAT. About the Gao Cao, I don't think it's as hard as Gaokao. But however, I don't know what Gao Gao means. But the rumors said it's the hardest exam of the world, and I think it's not the hardest. However, uh, for me, for people who is coming from language background, I think math will be harder than they will think.

SPEAKER_03: 43:10

Thanks, Armin, for sharing that. I hope you did well in your CSEA too. And how about you, Malija? How's your experience?

SPEAKER_01: 43:18

So I was applying for bachelor in medicine and surgery. So I needed maths and chemistry, but I took physics as an extra. For me, the exam was not that hard because I already wrote my A levels here in Botswana. But I would say I did pretty well in chemistry and maths. Physics for me was a bit hard because in A levels we're used to using calculators. So the problem is we didn't have calculators, so there was that was one major big issue which we I think most students are going to face if they don't practice. Practice without calculators, it's going to be a bit hard for them. So I I think it wasn't, I don't think it's as hard as Galkal because it's fairly medium-leveled exam. And for those who are going to write, I think they should just look at a practice without calculators and just time it. If you time your questions how much time you take, it'll be easier for them. So it's not that hard. Yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 44:29

Right. Nice for uh thanks for sharing that, Maliha. Do you have guys have any other tips maybe for preparations or during the day? Because I figured that it's kind of like a one-chance uh exam, meaning if let's say your internet dies on a day, then goodbye, CSEA. So maybe you guys have some tips based on your uh experience in taking CSEA.

SPEAKER_01: 44:50

Um okay, so the first thing was when we registered for the exam, you get ticket, your exam ticket, right? And then you also get before the exams, you write mock exams, so you get the feel of how the exam is going to be, how the timing is going to be, and all that. So I advise whoever is going to write it to take those mock exams because they're very important. You get the hang of what you need, what you don't need, and all that. Because I took both the mock exams and it made me very familiar with how I need to do during the exam day. And the problem of them saying that your Wi-Fi, if you don't, if your Wi-Fi stops, your exam dies. I think it didn't happen with me, but when we get our exam tickets, we also get a guideline. So you have to have your backup Wi-Fi with you. I had a backup Wi-Fi on my phone with me. So it's not like if you don't have if your Wi-Fi dies, you're going to, your exam is going to, you can call for a supervisor and they will help you use your backup Wi-Fi and you can get back in the test. That is that was what we were told. And also tips and tricks. The first tip is practice before the exams. If you don't have practice on time management, the time won't be enough for you. Because one hour for maths without a calculator was really difficult to practice with because I had to not have a calculator. I had to time myself for each question. And it was not as easy. Because in A levels, maths was not multiple choice. We used to write structured maths. So when it goes from structured to multiple choice, you need a lot of practice. So practice then time management used without a calculator and the mock exams. What else? Oh, and the technical issues before the exam, they're too random where you can check your technical support, your mic, your camera, and all that. So there's no need to worry for what's going to happen because you'd have already checked everything before the exams, a few days before the exams. So, and even if because there was a problem with my facial recognition, I couldn't, they couldn't scan it properly. So then I called for a supervisor, and then she helped me, she just helped me sign in because she saw my face and then she asked me to show the passport, and then I showed her the passport, and then she's like, okay, I'll just I'll make you skip the facial recognition and you can sign in. So if you have any problems, there are people there to help you. That's why I'm saying for the Wi-Fi, even you don't need to panic, don't stress, just call for an invigilator. They will come as soon as possible, and then they'll help you sign back in.

SPEAKER_03: 47:44

Thanks for the tips, Maleha. Do you have something that you want to add, Armin?

SPEAKER_00: 47:47

So Maleha already talked about math, so I'm not going to talk about math, even though I don't, I'm not good at math. So let's just skip it. About the humanities Chinese, I would say I would give some tips. So there is the guideline that you can download from CSEA webpage. However, it's not so clearly uh what HSK level uh will be sufficient to pass the CSCA exam. And a lot of people here they think like HSK 5 is enough, but I'm gonna be honest, like the first part of the first part of the exam, you can like you have to write the tones there and something like that. And it was really easy. I think even people with HSK3 can easily handle it. However, the last part of the exam where you have to answer the questions according to the text, it was really hard, even though I have like higher than HSK 5, but it was hard for me because there you can clearly see uh linguistics words and vocab that you are not you cannot learn during HSK course. So it's I think it's really hard and base level of uh humanities Chinese. I would say at least you have to have HSK 5 because at the uh because in the two parts of the test, uh the last two parts of the test, they're really hard, I think. For somebody who have HSK 4 and they only practice the standard course, like the most popular HSK, like their red book, uh, I think it would be hard for them. And right now, not the top universities, but there are still universities who expect expect who accept HSK4. And this like creates a mismatch because in in order to have a better CSCA result, you have to have a higher Chinese level, higher than HSK4. That's why I think getting HSK and passing the CSCA, they're like right now, they create mismatch and they're totally different. For my friends, I would say that just try to uh read a lot because uh the last parts are mainly the text, they are so important. Just try to uh read academic papers and something like that, or even try to uh read some, I don't know, research, some papers about Chinese culture and Chinese, maybe fairy tales, something like that. But make sure that you understand every each word because it's there are some specific exercises that you have to uh choose from a certain sentence. You have to choose uh the you have to choose the uh way to paraphrase a sentence, something like that. So try to really just understand the meaning of the text, not just quickly read it, and the result of your quick uh reading will be nothing. So just during the Humanities Chinese, also we have one and a half hour, it's not one hour. So the I think one and a half hour is like a really great time. That's why I think you had just have to carefully read all the lines, all the words, and try to get like uh the meaning of the every passage of the text.

SPEAKER_03: 51:15

Thank you so much for the clips. I think it's very useful. Well, you've seen some of some part of our podcast because you were the audience there, but so I was just wondering, just a little bit curious about you guys who are in the process of applying to uh Chinese universities, and then uh in the podcast, we talk about uh, you know, students are going to rising destinations, including China, and also we talk about AI. So I was just wondering about your personal reasons, like why you guys decided to choose China to pursue your studies.

SPEAKER_00: 51:47

So maybe I'll start first. Uh so actually I've been like in this Chinese community, in Armenian Chinese community community in a while, starting from 2018. So it's been eight years almost. Chinese language is held so much power in his hands, so um it leaves no other choice. So you uh I think somebody, uh somebody like me who needs uh an academic path to like go through universities and try to learn the I don't know to get from the university the best. I think China is the best choice. And somebody who is coming from not so like rich family, I would say that China is very affordable. Like you getting top-tier education, like the I don't not top tier, the toppist tier education, uh, with uh comparing to like America or uh Europe with like just with the coins. I am not trying to be rude, but I'm just saying that in China the education is like beyond, and the education that we give and the money that we pay to them is like beyond, and plus we have tons of scholarship, and there wouldn't be any other choice than uh apply to Chinese universities.

SPEAKER_03: 53:11

How about you, Malija? What's your reason for applying to Chinese universities for your MBBS program? I mean, I know China is one of the most popular MBBS destinations for international students, but do you have any specific reasons why you choose China specifically?

SPEAKER_01: 53:27

The first reason I chose China for MBBS was because it was very affordable compared to other countries. Like, so I'm an Indian and I have stayed in Botswana my whole life. After I was born, two months after I was born, I moved here with my parents. So if now I want to go back and do MBBS in China, I have to give their NET exam, and it's a long process. And even if I go back now, it's a very low chance of scholarship. While China has a lot of affordable tuition and living costs, which I've heard, because I've had a lot, I have a lot of friends who are already in China who are studying there, and they told me it's very affordable, the tuition fees are lower, the living costs are very affordable, and they also told me there are many scholarships available for international students. And secondly, it was because I was I just searched up high-quality universities and then Jejiang popped up and many other, not only from I just searched high-quality universities for MBBS around the world, and then I got Zhejiang, Fudan, and all those. So it was it was really good when I looked at them, they had a strong medicine program. So I was like, let me just do some research. I also did for other countries, like I searched up Canada, I searched up Australia, Zambia, and all those. But the thing is for Canada, if I go there, there's a lot process, they won't take me directly with A levels. You have to do another pre-med course or something. And other countries, you it's very expensive, it's very expensive compared to China. So that was one of my reasons. Another reason was it's globally recognized. It's China is like the second largest economy in the world, and it's globally recognized. So the degree, if I get a degree from a Chinese university, it's really good. And also I heard it's very strong in STEM and technology. So those are some of the reasons. The main reason was it has a global recognition, it has low tuition fees, and just you know, naturally, it's nice to go someplace where you know it feels familiar. So yeah.

SPEAKER_03: 55:51

Thanks for sharing that, uh Maliha. I think, yeah, that's those are like some of the most common reasons why you choose China. And we saw that it's getting increasingly more and more popular among international students. I mean, to choose China as a study destination. And then just I think just one final question for me, unless Rich and Olivia has their questions they want to discuss in here. But uh in the podcast today, we were also talking about AI and also how students can utilize AI. So I was wondering, because you guys are students, right? Did you guys use AI? And what do you think about AI and how you are using it as a student? Do you think it's beneficial to use AI? But how do you think you guys as students can uh use AI responsibly?

SPEAKER_00: 56:34

Let me just actually I've used AI and I use AI on a daily basis. However, so let me just quickly give a background of myself. So right now I am in my KPR actually, and I'm working as a Chinese teacher here in Armenia, and I was preparing to write in the comments during the podcast. Yeah, and I was wanting I wanted to tell that daily basis AI helps me a lot. Like I can use AI to quickly make some tests, make some mock-up, I don't know, exams for my students, and just it so makes our uh job so much easier. And I've also worked in uh import environments. I was an import manager from China, China focused, and AI also helped me there to get like information from a lot of Chinese like manufacturers. But in the educational environment, uh for example, I'm not gonna lie, I used AI in my personal statement. However, I'm not I think AI texts in the LTE basis, they are too generic. And it's really, I think if you really rely on AI generated text, I think it's 100% reject from university because you kind of have to show them they do they you do care about their university. They you did your research. And I'm playing not one university, I'm not playing some couple of. And I would say for every each personal statement, I dedicated like one week at least to really research and try to find out what the what that university is special, what's about what is special about that university, and uh AI cannot do uh that thing, like 100% sure. I think human they can do it better, and you just have to be a little bit creative. And I like a little bit like set emotions in the personal statement. You have to uh show that you are not a robot, you have your the things that you are worried about, you have some things that you think that you should do in China or shouldn't. And I don't know. For me, personal statement is all about honest, and you and if you write that with Chat GPT, where is the honesty? Like you are being honest that you use a robot. I don't know. That's not my case. I only used Chat GPT to just to just be sure that I choose the right words in the right sentences because if uh especially that time, you are uh literally some to see where you did all the wrong things and you are doubting yourself. Self-doubt is the highest uh point there when you write a personal statement. So that's it.

SPEAKER_03: 59:35

Right. Thanks for sharing that. Anything that you want to add, Malika?

SPEAKER_01: 59:39

Um, I think Amand covered most of it, like even for let's say for CSEA, I used a lot of AI to understand the concepts because I would watch a video, and if I wouldn't understand some parts of it, I would go on AI and I would literally like I would literally go on chat GPT and ask them to explain this concept in chemistry. So it's not like you'd only use need to use AI, but you can use AI with a lot of videos and everything to understand so it's easier for people. Like for everyone, for I used a lot of chat GPT for chemistry to understand some of the topics and all that. And even for maths, but for maths and chemistry, I would usually watch videos. But I mean for maths and physics, I would watch videos, but for chemistry, I used a lot of chat GPT to understand because it's easier to read and just get it understanded. So I don't think like for to answer one of your broadcast questions, I think AI is really good to students because you understand. But if you use it in the wrong way, like just to copy your answers from for the homework and all that, I think you're not gonna get far with that. Because in the final exams, you won't have AI.

SPEAKER_03: 1:00:54

Yeah, that's true. That's true. Yeah. All right, yeah, I think that sums up everything that uh we wanted to discuss today with you guys. And yeah, then again, thank you so much for being here. We really appreciate you taking the time to share about your uh experience in taking the CSEA, but not only that, also to share your views on studying in China about AI as well. So we really appreciate this time with you guys. Thank you so much for taking a part in this podcast, and we wish you all the best, especially with your admissions. We hope that it will come out successful and you can come to China to share. Thank you. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_02: 1:01:29

Good luck for your application. Good luck, guys, thank you very much, guys.

SPEAKER_04: 1:01:33

Really interesting stories. Cheers, please. All right, cheers, bye.